What’s particularly telling is that all of the majority report commenters didn’t even appear to have read Singal’s piece before rushing to defend GLAAD’s fatwa against Singal.
Sam even mentioned that he doesn’t “know [singal’s] work from Adam”.
The whole moment was an illustration in why the whole “intentions don’t matter, effects do” argument is a cynical dodge because you can just decide that some derivative impact occurred because you feel bad. As in the MR’s actions this proves persistent even if you can demonstrate that the complainant has not only misunderstood what you were doing but doesn’t even understand the basic impacts/facts they’re basing their opinion on. (For example take a look at the segment where Jesse manages to get Emma to admit she doesn’t understand the standards of care)
This whole incident boils my piss particularly because it’s a clear illustration of a underhanded methodology partisans (particularly in the social justice left) have openly adopted. Singal in particular has been a lightning rod for it because he’s very careful about being specific and well sourced in his claims and in taking care to qualify his, fairly measured and often empathetic, reasoning.
Watching seemingly respectable media figures disqualify themselves on this issue & for this reason has been truly disheartening. Both Jon Stewart & Oliver’s programs on trans medicine disqualified them as trustworthy or measured voices for me.
@Jeff reading your work, I’ve often thought that I noticed the rough period you departed from LWT from the sharp decline in the number of times Jon would include a “to be fair” line in his arguments. It was one of the reasons I had some regard for the arguments of the show because he made a point to recognize aspects of the other side’s perspective and showed some epistemological humility.
The recent Blocked and Reported episode where they played clips of this interview really raised my blood pressure, real “know nothing” stuff from majority report. Great point in this article that journalism that censors itself because certain facts are verboten (once the facts are adequately contextualised) is just propaganda. I hope someone is teaching this to the undergrads who go on to be graphics designers and IT specialists at the big left leaning media outlets and seem to be the first to protest if real journalists report actual facts that don’t fit the prevailing narrative.
It seems that trans issues have become the new third rail of left wing politics. Or do I mean sacred cow? Whatever the correct metaphor, any deviation from “transitioning is always good at any age” is met with howls of outrage.
I’m a Democrat and pretty progressive, at least on social issues. I have an adult friend who was a masculine gay woman for most of his life but is now a very happy trans man. I also have a friend whose teenage son transitioned several years ago and is now to all appearances a very happy teenage (trans) girl. In both of these cases, the individuals involved were free to make their own decisions in consultation with their health care professionals. The idea of a teenager transitioning makes me a bit uncomfortable, but that decision wasn’t my call - nor should it be.
On the other hand, it should be okay to say that perhaps not every teenager who feels uncomfortable with his or her gender at birth should transition. I especially worry about girls who may be a bit masculine (we used to just call this “being a tomboy” and didn’t worry about it) who are being socially conditioned to believe that because they don’t feel conventionally feminine, they must really be males who need hormones and surgery. In some cases I think time and therapy could resolve that. But the decision should be left up to the young person, his or her parents, and competent health care professionals.
There has definitely been a chilling effect with regards to trans issues- for example, the founders of Trans Lifeline, a suicide hotline for trans people, stole $400,000 and got quietly shuffled out without a single media outlet reporting on it. Unfortunately, one of the only places you can read about it on the Internet is Kiwi Farms, and it didn’t get on their radar until the founders showed up at the house of the guy who runs the forum to try to get him to take down a thread about a friend. It’s insane.
> Having watched the exchange, I envy the version of me who didn’t know they existed; if anyone knows how to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind these clowns out of my brain, please see me in the comments section.
Once, I seem to recall stumbling on a piece of Online Bullshit that caused me to literally go to my neighborhood brewery and start drinking barley wine with the express intent of murdering any brain cells with the audacity to start record this affair to my long-term memory.
No, I don't recall the specific Online Bullshit. Perhaps some priming could pull it up from the dredges of my long-term memory, but it seems to have been at least rendered inaccessible. I don't know if it was the alcohol, the ritual, or some combination, but it worked.
It's probably too late for you, though. Now that it's committed to your long-term memory, good luck.
It's a cult. The belief in magical "trans kids" is unfalsifiable. Believers will lie, smear, distort, and project every dark corner of their own minds on anyone who resists the cult. If Seder et al were forced to admit they were wrong, and that gender thetans might not exist in children, it would absolutely devastate their egos. Can't have that. Much better to blame Jesse Singal for Republicans taking the obvious political win by opposing the child-sterilizing Moloch cult. No way they are no the wrong side of history, no way, they have all the correct opinions!
"His argument is that Singal’s writing is harmful, hence the lengthy torture metaphor that was at least as torturous as anything the CIA did at a black ops site.
" I think those decisions should be made by the teenager and their parents, with guidance from well-trained clinicians informed by the best science we have. "
I have issues with this in that historically we do not allow teenagers and parents to make decisions about the minor if their is a risk of harm.
What if the teenager and parents want to push conversion therapy or female circumcision. I dont necessarily put puberty blockers in that class, but genital surgery is certainly irreversible.
Puberty blockers are probably reversible but we are unsure of possible negative effects and this is why in the UK and Sweden they have take a much more cautious approach.
imo opinion underlying this whole issue is what I consider a strange mental construct that because a person feels like a different gender they have to alter their body to match that gender. imo that is regressive. In olden days if you had a penis you couldn't act like a girl for fear of being a 'sissy'. Now if you choose to act like a girl, you can't have a penis. The arguments for transition seem to imply that we are defined by our anatomy not our preferences and personality.
What if Ron DeSantis uses Seder’s argument to ban books? By his own logic, Seder is only giving ammunition to his enemies. If he believed what he’s saying he would have to stop writing altogether.
What’s particularly telling is that all of the majority report commenters didn’t even appear to have read Singal’s piece before rushing to defend GLAAD’s fatwa against Singal.
Sam even mentioned that he doesn’t “know [singal’s] work from Adam”.
The whole moment was an illustration in why the whole “intentions don’t matter, effects do” argument is a cynical dodge because you can just decide that some derivative impact occurred because you feel bad. As in the MR’s actions this proves persistent even if you can demonstrate that the complainant has not only misunderstood what you were doing but doesn’t even understand the basic impacts/facts they’re basing their opinion on. (For example take a look at the segment where Jesse manages to get Emma to admit she doesn’t understand the standards of care)
This whole incident boils my piss particularly because it’s a clear illustration of a underhanded methodology partisans (particularly in the social justice left) have openly adopted. Singal in particular has been a lightning rod for it because he’s very careful about being specific and well sourced in his claims and in taking care to qualify his, fairly measured and often empathetic, reasoning.
Watching seemingly respectable media figures disqualify themselves on this issue & for this reason has been truly disheartening. Both Jon Stewart & Oliver’s programs on trans medicine disqualified them as trustworthy or measured voices for me.
@Jeff reading your work, I’ve often thought that I noticed the rough period you departed from LWT from the sharp decline in the number of times Jon would include a “to be fair” line in his arguments. It was one of the reasons I had some regard for the arguments of the show because he made a point to recognize aspects of the other side’s perspective and showed some epistemological humility.
"If a reporting of the facts is so destabilizing to your position, then maybe the problem is your position". I love that.
The recent Blocked and Reported episode where they played clips of this interview really raised my blood pressure, real “know nothing” stuff from majority report. Great point in this article that journalism that censors itself because certain facts are verboten (once the facts are adequately contextualised) is just propaganda. I hope someone is teaching this to the undergrads who go on to be graphics designers and IT specialists at the big left leaning media outlets and seem to be the first to protest if real journalists report actual facts that don’t fit the prevailing narrative.
2008: Reality has a known liberal bias
2023: We can’t let people have *facts*! It makes them conservative!
It seems that trans issues have become the new third rail of left wing politics. Or do I mean sacred cow? Whatever the correct metaphor, any deviation from “transitioning is always good at any age” is met with howls of outrage.
I’m a Democrat and pretty progressive, at least on social issues. I have an adult friend who was a masculine gay woman for most of his life but is now a very happy trans man. I also have a friend whose teenage son transitioned several years ago and is now to all appearances a very happy teenage (trans) girl. In both of these cases, the individuals involved were free to make their own decisions in consultation with their health care professionals. The idea of a teenager transitioning makes me a bit uncomfortable, but that decision wasn’t my call - nor should it be.
On the other hand, it should be okay to say that perhaps not every teenager who feels uncomfortable with his or her gender at birth should transition. I especially worry about girls who may be a bit masculine (we used to just call this “being a tomboy” and didn’t worry about it) who are being socially conditioned to believe that because they don’t feel conventionally feminine, they must really be males who need hormones and surgery. In some cases I think time and therapy could resolve that. But the decision should be left up to the young person, his or her parents, and competent health care professionals.
There has definitely been a chilling effect with regards to trans issues- for example, the founders of Trans Lifeline, a suicide hotline for trans people, stole $400,000 and got quietly shuffled out without a single media outlet reporting on it. Unfortunately, one of the only places you can read about it on the Internet is Kiwi Farms, and it didn’t get on their radar until the founders showed up at the house of the guy who runs the forum to try to get him to take down a thread about a friend. It’s insane.
> Having watched the exchange, I envy the version of me who didn’t know they existed; if anyone knows how to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind these clowns out of my brain, please see me in the comments section.
Once, I seem to recall stumbling on a piece of Online Bullshit that caused me to literally go to my neighborhood brewery and start drinking barley wine with the express intent of murdering any brain cells with the audacity to start record this affair to my long-term memory.
No, I don't recall the specific Online Bullshit. Perhaps some priming could pull it up from the dredges of my long-term memory, but it seems to have been at least rendered inaccessible. I don't know if it was the alcohol, the ritual, or some combination, but it worked.
It's probably too late for you, though. Now that it's committed to your long-term memory, good luck.
One of the elephants in the room is "how did anti-scientific dehumanizing fact-free narratives come to occupy so much of the public square"?
It's a cult. The belief in magical "trans kids" is unfalsifiable. Believers will lie, smear, distort, and project every dark corner of their own minds on anyone who resists the cult. If Seder et al were forced to admit they were wrong, and that gender thetans might not exist in children, it would absolutely devastate their egos. Can't have that. Much better to blame Jesse Singal for Republicans taking the obvious political win by opposing the child-sterilizing Moloch cult. No way they are no the wrong side of history, no way, they have all the correct opinions!
"His argument is that Singal’s writing is harmful, hence the lengthy torture metaphor that was at least as torturous as anything the CIA did at a black ops site.
Lmao. Love this piece
Wait, what’s this? I’m a card-carrying good liberal, and I haven’t been admitted to an orgy, not even once! I feel cheated!
Seriously, this is an excellent article. 100% spot on.
I'm in shock.
"... hence the lengthy torture metaphor that was at least as torturous as anything the CIA did at a black ops site."
Did you really just equate the exercise of free speech to some of our governments most diabolical violations of human rights? You monster.
To say nothing of slandering the names of justices of the highest court in the land with repugnant implications of cannibalism. How dare you!
You just bought a one way ticket to Cancelville, pal. I hope you enjoy the ride.
" I think those decisions should be made by the teenager and their parents, with guidance from well-trained clinicians informed by the best science we have. "
I have issues with this in that historically we do not allow teenagers and parents to make decisions about the minor if their is a risk of harm.
What if the teenager and parents want to push conversion therapy or female circumcision. I dont necessarily put puberty blockers in that class, but genital surgery is certainly irreversible.
Puberty blockers are probably reversible but we are unsure of possible negative effects and this is why in the UK and Sweden they have take a much more cautious approach.
imo opinion underlying this whole issue is what I consider a strange mental construct that because a person feels like a different gender they have to alter their body to match that gender. imo that is regressive. In olden days if you had a penis you couldn't act like a girl for fear of being a 'sissy'. Now if you choose to act like a girl, you can't have a penis. The arguments for transition seem to imply that we are defined by our anatomy not our preferences and personality.
What if Ron DeSantis uses Seder’s argument to ban books? By his own logic, Seder is only giving ammunition to his enemies. If he believed what he’s saying he would have to stop writing altogether.
Ah, Sam Seder: he was pretty good in his Air America days in the early 2000s (Seder v. Maron was very funny). Then, yikes.
I mean, if you are going to use "the arrow of time" in your arguments....